FS2004 Screenshots Here!!! - Page 123
Page 123 of 153 FirstFirst ... 2373113115116117118119120121122123124125126127128129130131133 ... LastLast
Results 3,051 to 3,075 of 3807

Thread: FS2004 Screenshots Here!!!

  1. #3051
    Quote Originally Posted by huub vink View Post
    Colours are often a reason for interesting discussions. When the current model paint manufactures like Humbrol, Revell, Tamiya, Vallejo, AK, etc can't dome to an agreement what shade a colour actually was, how can we?

    But I think the aircraft had NS Blue Grey upper surfaces and NS Light Grey under surfaces according to the specification M-485a from the Bureau of Aeronautics.

    Cheers,
    Huub
    The colours should have a federal standard ( FS ) number
    Which can then be cross referenced to RGB

    Ttfn

    Pete

  2. #3052
    Quote Originally Posted by huub vink View Post
    Colours are often a reason for interesting discussions. When the current model paint manufactures like Humbrol, Revell, Tamiya, Vallejo, AK, etc can't dome to an agreement what shade a colour actually was, how can we?

    But I think the aircraft had NS Blue Grey upper surfaces and NS Light Grey under surfaces according to the specification M-485a from the Bureau of Aeronautics.

    Cheers,
    Huub
    The colours should have a federal standard ( FS ) number
    Which can then be cross referenced to RGB

    Like so


    http://www.pmcn.de/English/Colors_US..._1941-1945.htm

    Ttfn

    Pete

  3. #3053
    Senior Administrator huub vink's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Noordwijk, The Netherlands (EHVB)
    Age
    65
    Posts
    10,267
    Pete,

    I'm afraid the Federal standard was not introduced until 1956! And all I know was that most colours from the BuAer specification M-485 didn't even match with the colours specified in the ANA Bulletin No.157 which was introduced as its successor in September 1943.

    As said colours are always a good source for a nice discussion. And even when you have the standard in your hands the real shade remains a guess. I had paint chips from the wings and fuselage the wreck from the same Bf109-G6. The wings were excavated long before the fuselage was. The RLM74 from the fuselage was half as dark as the RLM74 found on the wings.

    Cheers,
    Huub

  4. #3054
    Hi folks, many thanks for inputs, affort and interest regarding colorscheme. I agree you Huub about a bit less blue, probably also too green? 13 red-white stripes added the tail-rudder. Looks so much better!! Those grey-blue Grumman Wildcats from Pete's link where helpful.. ( http://www.pmcn.de/English/USN%20Mar...kings%20II.htm ) Nothing is more inspiring than such a good polite and friendly discussion!





    Cheers
    daypharris
    Dag

  5. #3055
    It is probably still a bit too dark I think. Did make a extra copy/backup of "g211.bmp", done some tweaking/adjusting as far as possible, resulting this.. This is the final result for me


    daypharris




  6. #3056
    Senior Administrator huub vink's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Noordwijk, The Netherlands (EHVB)
    Age
    65
    Posts
    10,267
    Well all I have to add is : "I like it"

    Cheers,
    Huub

  7. #3057
    I know absolute zero about USN colors or markings, but it reminds me of the Atlantic theater colors. Great paint by the way, defiantly take a copy

  8. #3058
    SOH-CM-2024 Mick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Easthampton, Mass., U.S.A.
    Age
    76
    Posts
    3,412
    Quote Originally Posted by huub vink View Post
    ... When the current model paint manufactures like Humbrol, Revell, Tamiya, Vallejo, AK, etc can't dome to an agreement what shade a colour actually was, how can we?..
    But I think the aircraft had NS Blue Grey upper surfaces and NS Light Grey under surfaces according to the specification M-485a from the Bureau of Aeronautics.
    Cheers,
    Huub
    As for model paints and decals, I think some of the reason is just laziness about doing the research, or more likely just ignorance of the available reference sources. How many model paint or decal makers - especially those outside the US - ever heard of those ceramic plates of pre-WW2 and wartime US Navy colors? Probably none of them. And if they heard of them, how many have the resources to travel to the National Bureau of Standards in Washington DC to look at them? Again, probably none. I can't blame them for not being aware of something so obscure.

    It doesn't help that some colors changed without their names being changed. For example, pre-WW2 Insignia Blue was a somewhat bright blue, lighter in comparison to what came later. As war looked more likely and camouflage was adopted, a considerably darker blue was used, but it was still called Insignia Blue. After the war it got a little lighter again, but not as light as it was before the war. Insignia Red got a little darker during the war too, though nothing like the degree of darkening that happened to the RAF roundel.

    And there was a mystery color that they never made a ceramic plate of: Admiral Blue, the color used on VIP aircraft assigned to admirals and some captains. All we know is that those who were there remembered it as being a somewhat darker and a little more purple than insignia blue, maybe a sort of Royal Blue, but the exact shade is lost to history. Not that this ever stopped me from painting a model in the Navy's VIP livery. (On plastic I used Pactra glossy Royal Blue. On digital models I wing it as best I can - and a lot of my earliest paint jobs got it much too bright and purple-ish)

    Maybe there's a financial aspect too, like minimizing the number of colors on a decal sheet? In my plastic modeling days I often grumbled about how generations of Airfix and Frog decal artists seemed to be convinced that the American national colors were Red, White & Black. But maybe it wasn't the artists - maybe it was some penny-pinching accountant telling them not to use so many colors of ink.

    Huub, you might be right about those colors on that Goose, but there is another possibility. There was a wartime color referred to as "PBY Blue." I don't know it's official name, if it had one. It was a but brighter, lighter and blue-er than the Blue-Gray color used in the early blue-gray over light gray camouflage. It was intended for flying boats and amphibians such as the PBY, which is how it got its colloquial name. The goose might have worn that as its top color. You can see good versions of that color on Shessi's latest PBY and on the earlier Goose paint job.

  9. #3059
    SOH-CM-2024 Mick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Easthampton, Mass., U.S.A.
    Age
    76
    Posts
    3,412
    Quote Originally Posted by Motormouse View Post
    The colours should have a federal standard ( FS ) number
    Which can then be cross referenced to RGB
    Ttfn
    Pete
    Yes, they should, and in fact they do. The trouble is that the federal standards were developed long after those colors were no longer in use, and they are only approximations anyway. FS595 was created so that government agencies wold have an easy way to tell paint manufacturers what colors they wanted, but they were close approximations at best and not meant to be precise records. The feds don't worry much about the exact, precise shade of green or gray that goes on its filing cabinets and other furnishings, and the FS standards were created mainly for that sort of stuff.

    There are other and more exact color standards, like the well-known British one that I can't remember the name of right now, and there are others too, but none of them existed when these colors were being made into paint and used on aircraft, so we can't be certain that they are accurately based on the actual paint color in use in those days.

    The ceramic plates are absolutely correct and reliable, but they are only accessible to those who have the resources to travel to examine them in person. One might think to photograph them but even the best cameras and films don't record colors perfectly, and if the photos were transmitted to someone else over the Interweb there are sources of potential corruption between sender and recipient, and what the colors look like to the recipient depends a lot on their monitor settings, monitor quality, video card quality and settings, and whatnot.

    Pinning down a color can be a very frustrating business! It's hard to criticize modelers too much when major museums often get it wrong!



  10. #3060
    SOH-CM-2024 Mick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Easthampton, Mass., U.S.A.
    Age
    76
    Posts
    3,412
    For what it's worth, I think the earlier Goose paint has the color colloquially called "PBY Blue," and I think that same color might be right for the later paint job too.

    The frustrating thing about colors is that there is always a correct answer, but we might not be able to find it! On the airplane at that time the color looked a certain way and no other, but all the research in the world might not be enough to figure it out in a particular situation.

  11. #3061
    Senior Administrator huub vink's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Noordwijk, The Netherlands (EHVB)
    Age
    65
    Posts
    10,267
    Hi Mick,

    Thanks for your response. In my country a lot of original material has been lost during and after the war. Simply because the Germans were not interested. And after the war, because people had plenty of other things to worry about. Pre-war Dutch aircraft were painted in a 3 colour scheme. There are currently more different theories about these colours and more different "authentic" examples than the Dutch had aircraft in 1940.

    To summarise the story, the paint was license made British aviation paint (Titanine), from a factory (Titanine Ltd.) which used their own colours standard. As the Dutch committee did not agree with one specific colour, these colours were changed ("warmer" no further description). The factory where this paint was made still exists and can be found roughly 5 kilometres from where I live. As there is so much guessing and nonsense told about these paints I was intrigued and decided to dive into the world of colour charts, standards, etc., I even visited the factory and the hall where the original paint was produced. Just to find out that nobody really knows and all documentation is lost. Too many bring their wild guessing as the absolute truth. And people who claim that imitation British paint from 1937 meets a US standard from 1956, which was too often changed to count since, should really start to read.....

    As history in the US (and most probably the UK as well) is less broken, there will be more original material. But even than you could wonder whether people really worried about the exact colour shade when the war industry was running at full speed. Olive green is olive green, but not all olives are equally green......

    Now I will quickly step down from my soap box

    Cheers,
    Huub

    PS And you comments about the decals are very recognisable!

  12. #3062

    Time for another screenshot

    Attachment 86168

    ttfn

    Pete

  13. #3063
    SOH-CM-2024 Mick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Easthampton, Mass., U.S.A.
    Age
    76
    Posts
    3,412
    Quote Originally Posted by Mick View Post
    ... the well-known British [standard] that I can't remember the name of right now...
    I remember! I remember! Munsell! It was Munsell!

    There are others but that's the one I couldn't think of. It was gnawing at me and I finally remembered. It defines colors based on three properties: color (hue), intensity and lightness and it can make a detailed comparison far deeper than the simple eyeball method of looking at a tiny FS95A color chip.


    Curiously, way back in the 1930s the U.S. Department of Agriculture adopted the Munsell system for accurately recording the color of soil samples. Apparently the other government departments were less interested in the accuracy and consistency of the colors of their office furniture, automobiles and airplanes.

  14. #3064
    Senior Administrator huub vink's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Noordwijk, The Netherlands (EHVB)
    Age
    65
    Posts
    10,267

    Does anybody know whether this repaint was already done?

    Triggered by Ted Cook's Miles Magister flying around Motormouse's scenery, I started a repaint which is on my to-do list for ages. Now I'm busy I can't imagine it has not yet been done before.

    (Very early work-in-progress, but I like the aluminium for the cowling!)







    Cheers,
    Huub

  15. #3065
    Quote Originally Posted by huub vink View Post
    Triggered by Ted Cook's Miles Magister flying around Motormouse's scenery, I started a repaint which is on my to-do list for ages. Now I'm busy I can't imagine it has not yet been done before.

    (Very early work-in-progress, but I like the aluminium for the cowling!)

    Wow, that's an unusual scheme, Huub, I don't think Ted's Magister has had any attention repaints wise, which is a shame as its a nice little model

    Ttfn

    Pete

  16. #3066
    Senior Administrator huub vink's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Noordwijk, The Netherlands (EHVB)
    Age
    65
    Posts
    10,267
    When I tried to find out which Miles Magister you used for AI with Chipping Norton, I ran into this pre-war model with spatted main wheels. This reminded me to the FCS Magister which was offered as a free download for a short period. The excitement was soon gone as the model was quite disappointing. It should work in both FS2004 and FSX, however it turned out to be a FS2004 model and was a headache in FSX. The only thing which was nice in the package was this livery. As I planned to do it for the superior Ed Cook model, it ended on my endless to-do-list and stayed there for too many years.

    The livery shows an aircraft from the aerobatic team from the Central Flying School at Upavon Airfield, Withshire in 1937. It was one of the first Magisters delivered to the RAF.

    As often with older models, there are some limitations, but in general I think it looks quite nice and pretty authentic.

    Cheers,
    Huub


  17. #3067
    Quote Originally Posted by huub vink View Post
    When I tried to find out which Miles Magister you used for AI with Chipping Norton, I ran into this pre-war model with spatted main wheels. This reminded me to the FCS Magister which was offered as a free download for a short period. The excitement was soon gone as the model was quite disappointing. It should work in both FS2004 and FSX, however it turned out to be a FS2004 model and was a headache in FSX. The only thing which was nice in the package was this livery. As I planned to do it for the superior Ed Cook model, it ended on my endless to-do-list and stayed there for too many years.

    The livery shows an aircraft from the aerobatic team from the Central Flying School at Upavon Airfield, Withshire in 1937. It was one of the first Magisters delivered to the RAF.

    As often with older models, there are some limitations, but in general I think it looks quite nice and pretty authentic.

    Cheers,
    Huub
    Ted only did 2 Magisters, IIRC, and early one you have there, and a later one without the spats

    Ttfn

    Pete

  18. #3068
    Senior Administrator huub vink's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Noordwijk, The Netherlands (EHVB)
    Age
    65
    Posts
    10,267
    Quote Originally Posted by Motormouse View Post
    Ted only did 2 Magisters, IIRC, and early one you have there, and a later one without the spats

    Ttfn

    Pete
    He did, but he released the "early war scheme" (fuselage still half yellow) as a separate download. But this model file is exactly the same as one with the "late war scheme" (with the full camouflage). However the titles are different, and your traffic file looks for the one with the title "title=magister_L", which is the one with the late war scheme.

    And all 3 of the are the V6 version...... To make it even more confusing!

    BTW talking about the AI traffic, the Havard pilots make a complete mess of it! They completely ignore the runways and fly through a closed hangar.... See images below. I know its a flying school, but I expect the candidate pilots to do better than this.

    Cheers,
    Huub




  19. #3069
    Quote Originally Posted by huub vink View Post

    BTW talking about the AI traffic, the Havard pilots make a complete mess of it! They completely ignore the runways and fly through a closed hangar.... See images below. I know its a flying school, but I expect the candidate pilots to do better than this.

    Cheers,
    Huub

    I'll get the CO to have words in his ear.

    Ttfn

    Pete

  20. #3070

    C9 Phantom....




    Is there anything else?


    M

  21. #3071
    Senior Administrator huub vink's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Noordwijk, The Netherlands (EHVB)
    Age
    65
    Posts
    10,267
    It doesn't even have a propeller

    Cheers,
    Huub

  22. #3072
    Redding Army Airfield Allen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    O85 Benton Field Airport
    Age
    36
    Posts
    5,444
    This thing is cursed and has done everything possible to fight me. Took a few hours to get the nose wheel to export with the right animation than a few more fighting CG and contact_points. Still got to fight the 4mm rule and more LODs.

    Attachment 86199
    "Let Being Helpful Be More Important Than Being Right!" Some SOH Founder.

  23. #3073
    AcWai has released a very nice set of Ki-44's for CFS2 that work pretty well in 9, always thought the 44 was a bit of a beast, so i figured i'd have to try it.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 44.jpg  

  24. #3074
    Another late war beast im having some fun with
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails t.jpg  

  25. #3075




    Hartwig
    __________________________________________________ _____________



Similar Threads

  1. FSX Screenshots Here!!
    By Walter in forum FSX General Discussion
    Replies: 14485
    Last Post: March 19th, 2024, 15:10
  2. FR P-40N: -1-CU... A Few More Screenshots
    By mike_cyul in forum FSX General Discussion
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: March 3rd, 2013, 22:08
  3. A few screenshots .
    By XLR8 in forum FSX General Discussion
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: May 13th, 2010, 11:07
  4. New Tailwind for FS2004! (yep, FS2004)
    By Lionheart in forum FS 2002/2004 General Discussion
    Replies: 26
    Last Post: June 17th, 2009, 19:19

Members who have read this thread: 217

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •