Landing Pattern Heights

[Pips]

I'm trying to get a handle on correct heights and speeds for flying the various legs of a landing circuit. In GA aircraft. Can anyone point me to a reasonably simple site that provides clear instructions?

[heywooood]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airfield_traffic_pattern

this is basic but accurate enough for FSx

[Pips]

Thanks for the reply heywooood. I've read that article, which is good for the actual direction of the pattern. But if doesn't cover heights of the various legs, nor the speed and rate of decent. Which is what I'm after.

[ryanbatc]

In the US, the average is 600-1000 ft AGL. Example, On climbout be at least 300agl before turning crosswind. You should reach pattern altitude on crosswind and before turning downind. So you're on downwind 1000ft AGL. Abeam your landing spot (the numbers of the runway or whatever you're landing point is), reduce power and you'll naturally start a descent. Single Pipers and Cessnas are normally 100kts or so on the downwind. 90 base, 80 base to final (with flaps), and 60-70 final approach.

Check out the AIM, section on traffic patterns:

http://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publi...4/aim0403.html

[TeaSea]

Yep, Ryan's correct.

Pattern altitude for most GA ops is about 1000 AGL. A little lower, or a little higher depending on the situation.

I personally don't start any turns until I have 500 feet between me and the ground, but I operate in Florida which is pretty flat and there's no pressing need to do otherwise.

Throttle controls altitude, angle of descent controls speed. Hard concept for lots of newer pilots to accept....but it works that way.

On my aircraft (PA 28/181 Archer II) 1 notch flaps abeam the numbers, one notch on the base leg, and one notch on final works best (full flaps) which incidentally, allows you to rest the heel of your hand on the Johnson bar and control the throttle with you fingertips. If there's a significant crosswind (like today), I use only two notches flaps and come in a little faster.

[Bushpounder]

We always climbed out to 400' before turning crosswind. We turned downwind at the "right" distance from the active and leveled off at 800'. When even with the numbers, we would throttle back and turn base and final as needed. While this is slow going in a C-150, stepping up to a twin sped this process up a bit.

Don

[Bone]

The speeds are really going to be a function of the plane you're in. Whereas 60-80 kts on final is good for most single engine GA planes, GA twins are going to be at a higher asirspeed. The Piper Aerostar does 120 to 140 kts on final, as an example The traffic pattern height is about 1000 feet AGL on downwind, as previously stated, unless you're in a turbine powered plane, then it's 1500 feet.

[tracyq144]

Here's a nice little video (part of the Aviator90 series) that uses FSX to show one way to do it:

http://www.flyaoamedia.com/blog/avia...90-episode-11/

[IanP]

Just to give another example, from the UK this time, everyone I have talked to about this was taught pretty much the same thing. "AAL" in this instance means "above aerodrome level".

- Take off.
- Gear up once climb established ("Positive rate" from airliner videos...)
- 300' AAL Flaps up, check Temps and Pressures.
- 600' AAL Turn crosswind, continue climb.
- 1000' AAL, level off, continue crosswind until airfield at "7 o'clock" position over your left shoulder.
- Maintain 1000' on downwind leg unless aerodrome chart says differently. Complete downwind checks (BUMPFICHH).
- Turn base when aerodrome is at 7 o'clock position. Set up for descent immediately by slowing aircraft and deploying approach flap (2 stages on a C152/C172/PA28)
- In theory, you should be turning final at about 600' if you got your speeds right.
- Add third stage of flap on final if necessary to increase descent rate.

That technique normally works, although I've found I have to modify it a bit in the sim because not everything behaves as it does in the real world - particularly winds. It's a good starting point to work from, though.

[TeaSea]

Just to give another example, from the UK this time, everyone I have talked to about this was taught pretty much the same thing. "AAL" in this instance means "above aerodrome level".

- Take off.
- Gear up once climb established ("Positive rate" from airliner videos...)
- 300' AAL Flaps up, check Temps and Pressures.
- 600' AAL Turn crosswind, continue climb.
- 1000' AAL, level off, continue crosswind until airfield at "7 o'clock" position over your left shoulder.
- Maintain 1000' on downwind leg unless aerodrome chart says differently. Complete downwind checks (BUMPFICHH).
- Turn base when aerodrome is at 7 o'clock position. Set up for descent immediately by slowing aircraft and deploying approach flap (2 stages on a C152/C172/PA28)
- In theory, you should be turning final at about 600' if you got your speeds right.
- Add third stage of flap on final if necessary to increase descent rate.

That technique normally works, although I've found I have to modify it a bit in the sim because not everything behaves as it does in the real world - particularly winds. It's a good starting point to work from, though.

I think the part that doesn't work well in the Sim is that you always seem to appear to be lower in the sim at 500 feet or so that in real life.

I agree that this is a good checklist.