Alphasim....how the mighty have fallen, discuss!

[calypsos]

I do not want to start a 'bash Alphasim' thread, but thought it an interesting reflection (a weather gauge anyway) of the state of our hobby IN GENERAL.
Alphasim were responsable (as Phil Perrot and his panel add-ons in MS98) for my interest in FS, a hobby I have now enjoyed for 12 years. I must not be the only one here sad not make a weekly visit to the AS website, to see screen shots of some upcoming new model.

At it's height, AS were releasing FS9 models every 2 weeks, of variable quality for 'pocket money' prices. The sort of Airfix (series 1) kit of the FS world, if you grew up in the 1960-70's. Nowadays we have had one model (Yak-52) and a half model (C-17) in 6 months. Even the 'we are still here' notice on the website looks a bit faded now.
So what has (all but) killed off AS, pirates? Customer service? (which was fine when the had a forum), model choices? the complexity of FSX and the time it takes to model nowadays? Good old lack of profit? or just a gradual decline of flight simming in general?

Remember, no mud slinging please, just some educated thoughts on the (possible) demise of an old long established developer and it's implications for the rest and the hobby in general.

[Kavehpd]

My personal reason for losing interest was the unnecessarily hostile attitude towards criticism. Ironically, this was mostly from a bunch of sugar junky teenagers who had no say in the business itself and just wanted to sound cool or whatever. But at the same time, I hardly ever remember any officials respond to this issue. As if it was simply ignored, if not encouraged.

Example: The C-17 thread: Michael was looking for photo references on refuelling formation lights, I found a couple and posted them. Turned out the modification was going to take a while. I got bombarded with PM and vicious posts for "disrespecting" the modeller and loads of other nonsense. Same happened when I pointed out the FSX HC3 Merlin update had the wrong landing gears. While Danno was emailing me a fixed version, trolls were doing their routine. I even got banned once (from both the shop and the forums) for #### knows what reason. This was completely out of the blue. Contacted Danno via email and he kindly sorted it out. Needless to say, when their forums went down, I didn't lose any sleep!

Come to think of it, the ONLY two reasonable officials I remember there were Michael and Danno. Welcomed the criticism and stayed out of all the BS in their forums.

What went on behind the scene over there is none of my business. I'm commenting from a customer's point of view.

[Lewis-A2A]

They stepped up there game, moved out of the budget market. If this was by choice or the fact fsx is a bit more timeframe unfriendly we dont know but I think IMO its very clear that as the prices went up so did the quality of the products.

Also when you are gauaging stuff its best to use common market and not specialist. I was explaining to falcon409 the other day on teamspeak how it was interesting that the guys on the fsbreak podcast had not heard of us (a2a) until the cub, IRIS until the latest GA stuff and I guess alphasim would be the same. fsbreak is a half decent measure as you have several hosts with different fs interest from small ga to large tubeliners, to VA's vatsim, to a Chris that runs the angle of attack website.

Its not the state of fs at all, its the state of a small segment. See carendo and PMDG etc to get a real gauge, and boy, business is as booming as ever.

[hey_moe]

I never had a problem with them. When I had problems with the DL or password, Phil would take care of the problem. I did notice lately their prices took kinda of a jump.Also FSX and most of the flight stuff has dropped due to MS backing out of the program . Which to me has a little to do with the market. I guess it is just their time...Mike

[kilo delta]

I'm sure that the piracy issue must have hurt them too?


Slightly OT...but does anyone know if their BN Islander (in collaboration with Flight1) is still on the cards?

[harleyman]

Remember, no mud slinging please!




Companies come and go...For many varied reasons I'm sure.

Personally I never follow close enough to know who or what makes a thing..I just purchase what I like...

I have better things to do than speculate over what is or has been....Or might be...but thats just me and my time...




But yes, they did seem to be the leader at one point...

[PRB]

I've got tons of Alphasim planes, and there isn't one of them I'm not happy with. Mountians rise, and turn to river mud, continents drift apart and meet again, and FS outfits are not immune. Alphasim deserves a lot of BRAVO ZULUs for all they have contributed to this hobby. I wish them well.

[stiz]

I'm sure that the piracy issue must have hurt them too?

piracy effects all the devs so thats really a null point, just depends on how much of an issue the developer wants to make of it.

To me they've just switched to higher detailed models, if they released a model now at the level of detail they where say 2 years ago (which was fine) at a cheaper price (say $20) it'd still be compared to the higer end models and generaly ripped apart for not being detailed enough and not haveing all the mod cons or accusim like features.

You cant really blame them for switching really, and who knows, they might have just had enough of fs developement, after all they seemed to get a lot of unfair stick for their stuff.

[Tweek]

The timescale is obviously down to the fact that they now try to build models with more depth and realism. While that's fine for some, a lot of simmers just want a Ctrl+E aircraft that they can just hop in and punch a few holes in the sky with, and for a long time, AlphaSim covered that market. Unfortunately, they seemed to take on board the unwanted 'advice' from armchair experts who represented the minority, that spoke the loudest, about how their models were wrong in this way and that, whereas most accepted the fact that they're cheap, easy to produce models with a low price tag, therefore there's bound to be a few errors here and there.

I'd love for them to return to how they used to be, and to be honest, there's nothing from stopping them doing so. You might say that with FSX has come longer development times, but individuals produce basic, but decent freeware models at a rate that I'd be more than happy with from AlphaSim - namely the likes of Piglet and Thomas Ruth, so I can't see why a company can't do that.

[d0mokun]

Though reluctant to comment I'll come out of the shadows just this once.

I think the 'sad' thing is that times change. People come, people go; groups come and go too. Purposes and plans change. Sometimes that just ends up with things not going quite how they were expected to, for whatever reason. No single reason can be attributed to anything.

There is always a future regardless of how sterile the present may seem.

My best regards to all.

Dan.

[arrowmaker]

Personally I will always be grateful to AlphaSim for being the only dev's out there to produce an English Electric Lightning , and three packages of them at that! As far as I am aware no other models exist, either payware or freeware, something I am at a loss to explain. After all it was one of greatest British jets ever built.

[mike_cyul]

I've always thought that the expression that "the only constant thing in life, is change" was a good one. Happens everywhere, to everyone and everything. Just have to adapt and learn and keep on going. I think that applies to Alphasim and us users and devs as well.

Voila, my philosophical input for the day.

Mike

[Prowler1111]

IMHO:
Wrong business decisions based on a equally wrong perception of their own market.
Bottom line..they drowned their own loyal customers with many addons no longer at budget prices and with also high developing costs which might have lead to a financial bottle neck.Better hold it there until the tide gets even.
Piracy? fat chance (IMHO), we are all victims of it at all levels, not a decisive factor even in a small market like this.
Lack of support? If there is one thing i can´t say bad things about AS, is their support, at least as a former customer, they got it right.

Prowler

[noddy]

I to have many Alphasim models, I always liked the way produced non-mainstream planes i.e. Cutlass, Skyray F-89 etc. Plus the Brit models, Lightning, Swift, Hunter and Scimitar.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o>
<o></o>
Guess the only problem was they were not to everybody’s tastes, and not big sellers. That's one of the reasons they backed of doing more Brit stuff.<o></o>
<o></o>
It is a shame not to see more coming, but as already stated people are becoming more demanding and wanting all the bells and whistles which pushes the development time out.<o></o>
<o> </o>
I for one do not mind a nice simple VC, I just want to jump in and fly. <o></o>

[MudMarine]

Theft of property is NOT a null point!

[Henry]

personally i have never had a problem with them
they have always helped me with problems
and when they decided to make there products available for free
after a certain time they gladly let us upload them here.
I do know they had a few internal problems but frankly thats none of my business
i still have and use many of there products
but change happens
H

[OBIO]

Let's not toll the death bell on Alphasim yet, not until there is an official statement from the upper echelons of Alphasim saying that they are throwing in the towel. Companies large and small encounter problems from time to time. Sometimes they decline for a bit, regroup, restructure and come back stronger than ever. Sometimes they fold. What will become of Alphasim is an unknown at the moment. I personally hope that they are able to regroup, refocus, and become even stronger than they were before. They are one of the longest running commercial sim companies....been around for 10 or 11 years now I think.

I do hate the fact that when I do a search for an Alphasim plane...trying to find some of their much older packages for use in CFS2....that 90% of the search returns are for pirate downloads of their products. If the amount of piracy that a company faces is any indication of the success of a company, Alphasim would surely be ranked as the most successful payware sim companies.

OBIO

[Lateral-G]

I think FSX was a game changer for them (as for many developers). From what I have gleaned over the years it seems making models for FS98 thru 2004 was pretty similar so those that were high up on the learning curve could crank out a new aircraft model pretty quickly. FSX seems to have changed that. Developers had to re-learn, use new software tools, new modeling methods. Some designers seemed to feel this was too much work.

I still see this today. In FS2004's heyday you had new models daily pop up on the various websites (both freeware and payware). FSX has really slowed it down. yeah, there's new stuff coming out....some very nice stuff to be sure....but at nowhere near the pace you saw for FS2002 or 2004.

I think we all know quite a few prolific model makers for FS98-2004 that have disappeared from the scene just because of FSX and it's intricacies.

I also think the "half-done release" business model may also be a contributing factor. It's hard to fork over $60 or more for a model that isn't completed. I know I'll get the AS C-17 eventually (once the VC is completed) but right now it's really hard to spend that much for an aircraft that isn't done. If the price were lower (by 1/2 at least) then maybe. CS' B-52 was a no-brainer because it was $15. I can live with that sort of price point. $60 is much harder to part with....no matter how stunning the exterior is.

i also think the management wore their heart on their sleeve. Any sort of criticism of their product was not tolerated. Even folks that tried to present criticism in a positive way were banned from the forums. You have to develop a thick skin when you're in business. yes, Phil was always helpful with problems with either the website or orders but he is a bit petulant, and this came thru in a very noticeable way.

I hope that AS can keep making planes. I have enjoyed all the ones I have bought (and I have over 20 over their planes in my hanger). It would be sad to see them no longer offering products.

-G-

[calypsos]

Excellent replies chaps, just the sort of discussion I had hoped for. :salute:

I am not writing them off, just bringing up the point that they are a shadow of the once market leading developer. It is a shame they seem to have stopped converting the old models to native FSX, it was great for customers like me (they were free upgrades) but it brought some new life back into 'old stock'.

I would still be happy to pay $20 for a model of a native FSX BAC Lightning or Short Belfast, even if they had simple systems and not all the switches worked.....but I guess I am in the minority.

[thunder100]

I think FSX was a game changer for them (as for many developers). From what I have gleaned over the years it seems making models for FS98 thru 2004 was pretty similar so those that were high up on the learning curve could crank out a new aircraft model pretty quickly. FSX seems to have changed that. Developers had to re-learn, use new software tools, new modeling methods. Some designers seemed to feel this was too much work.

my 5 cents go in same direction.I have helped to develop several freeware planes more prominently Connies.

From FS2002 to FS2004 workload went up 50% to get a decent one (Fzdigns Connie was more heavy as Howard wanted the best) but FSX is very different.FS2004 by 2 fore external and then double for an VC.So planes must increase in price seeing the time spent.

Now the sad fact looking to download figures but also talking to a developer is taht the FS community dont grow anymore,they just split into 50% Fs2004 and the other rest FSX.So you cannot offset more work by more sales.

Its not only AS.Look to capatin sim-->B52 exterior after 2 years and VC after annother year

I hope that AS keeps going and I am still buying planes i can buy nowhere else** .I accept a slow development rate

Roland

**Where can you buy a TSR-2,a F-111, a good B1

[Shane Olguin]

Hey guys,

Thought you'd like to hear from one of the team members. After a long hiatus I have rejoined the AlphaSim team. I was very happy to discover that there are quite a few projects currently in the pipe. The company is alive and well, and we are preparing to release quite a few new aircraft as well as updates to older releases.

I'm excited to get back to work myself!

[Skittles]

I always wonder what effect piracy actually has on sales of FSX related goodies.

I have never pirated anything (except downloading a back-up of something I already have bought and own, which is of course perfectly legal - and none of those things flight sim related). The only real figure that matters from a financial standpoint (differing from a moral standpoint) is the percentage of people who would have bought the item, yet did not because they pirated it instead. It would be completely wrong to suggest this number was anything close to 100%, I would imagine it is around the <10%, or therabouts.

[d0mokun]

I'd like to comment on the FSX dev side if I may.

For AS I think FSX was a driving factor, not a limiting one. The SE.5a was one of the first commercial FSX products to be made available for example, and there was always a drive to upgrade and update all old models to FSX standard. FSX and its abilities were always foremost in planning. This did lead to problems, given, but generally it worked out.

There are plenty of reasons I am sure for the lack of publicity of present, but I don't think (speaking as someone who 'was there') FSX is to blame.

Best
Dan.

[gonzonm]

I hate to say it, but i think it's a bit of what have you done lately. This is a hobby all about what is new, and instant gratifcation. In this e-market you need to regularly put out products to keep yourself on peoples minds.

[MudMarine]

I never had a problem with alphasim. And I own just about every plane they produced. I hope they come back stronger than ever.