Flightsim Community 2023 survey results

[Javis]

https://navigraph.com/blog/survey-2023

Interesting ?.. Mwoah.. Seems we (military aircraft aficionados) are still a niche within a niche, or is 12 million users not a niche anymore ?.... (i read somewhere about half a billion copies of GTA have been sold since beginning of the franchise)

In the "MSFS 2024 Expectations" department exactly 0% score for 'Better Camera System'...

Oh,Well part One

[dvj]

Facinating that over 93% of the respondents valued the top 4 fetures in addon aircraft. This should be a message to those developers who say it does not matter and that just good enough is just good enough. While folks are likely to jump on MSFS 2024, I think it is going to be a mess for a long time to bring over aircraft and scenery that are supposed to be compatible.

[DennyA]

It's an interesting survey because it's only representative of a specific population, not the entire market. Because it's Navigraph (people looking for a deep simulation of actual flying) and third-party addon publishers (which are by nature going to be mostly PC fliers, as most Xbox MSFS folks are focused on the Marketplace), the vast majority folks being surveyed are mid- to hardcore PC pilots. Xbox users can't use Navigraph, and only a tiny percentage likely haunt PMDG forums, for example.

But it is a useful look at what the core GA/airliner PC pilot is looking for.

Also, poor AeroflyFS.

[Javis]

Also, poor AeroflyFS.

Certainly, yes. It seems like they can't get their P's & Q's together... I remember the release, you could do almost nothing but you could fly an F-18 full throttle thru the Swiss valleys and mountains, a bit like the Mach Loop. Best sense of speed i ever experienced in a flight sim. But then MSFS came peeping around the corner..

Do we know of another 2023 FS survey that is not setup by a vendor ?....Maybe less 'biased' ?

For all i know the IFE/Heatblur Tommy the Cat should be 2023 'Best of Show' in our neck of the woods.. I mean check out the screenshot department..

[Priller]

Statistical value of this survey is almost next to zero.

If a really representative survey is to be done, they should contact the communities that are around. Not the easiest thing to do, but this thing is worthless.

But this is navigraph. Their goal is to promote their stuff and the addons that use it.

I'll never use their stuff, but then, I don't consider myself to be a pilot. I'm an aviation enthousiast.

Priller

[jmig]

Statistical value of this survey is almost next to zero.

If a really representative survey is to be done, they should contact the communities that are around. Not the easiest thing to do, but this thing is worthless.

But this is navigraph. Their goal is to promote their stuff and the addons that use it.

I'll never use their stuff, but then, I don't consider myself to be a pilot. I'm an aviation enthusiast.

Priller

Yeah, I didn't take the survey this year. I have in the past but was out of town visiting kids and grandkids. No time for surveys.

I think the survey is more representative than intimated here. I never fly airliners or go to airliner forums. However, I have seen the survey pitched in more than one general flightsim forum.

Now, I agree the X-box crowd isn't represented, But, I don't consider those guys serious flightsim nerds. I see them as gamers who see MSFS as another game to play. From what I have read M$ treats them as gamers. How often do you see people asking for this feature and that feature in X-Box that is found on PCs, and how often does M$ deliver? Rarely!

Does anyone at M$ read the survey and take it under advisement? Does the sun rise in the west?

[collensr]

so who do we think would a more representative/objective/meaningful sponsor for a more broader cast survey i.e. catching both Xbox players but also a wider sample of PC users?

[Priller]

Yeah, I didn't take the survey this year. I have in the past but was out of town visiting kids and grandkids. No time for surveys.

I think the survey is more representative than intimated here. I never fly airliners or go to airliner forums. However, I have seen the survey pitched in more than one general flightsim forum.

Now, I agree the X-box crowd isn't represented, But, I don't consider those guys serious flightsim nerds. I see them as gamers who see MSFS as another game to play. From what I have read M$ treats them as gamers. How often do you see people asking for this feature and that feature in X-Box that is found on PCs, and how often does M$ deliver? Rarely!

Does anyone at M$ read the survey and take it under advisement? Does the sun rise in the west?

Hi John,

I never mentioned the X-Box crowd, and quite frankly, I wasn't even thinking about them when I wrote that post.

Cheers,

Priller

[K5083]

Priller is correct. For many reasons, some but not all of which are stated above, the survey is not representative of any population of interest except possibly for Navigraph's consumer base. This is not just the population of PC simmers interested in deep flying simulation, but for those who are inclined to pay Navigraph's price when equivalent information, or at least a sufficient amount for flight simming, is freely available. There probably is also a population they are not reaching of real pilots who don't need Navigraph because they have Foreflight or some real aviation service.

I did complete the survey, just because I had a few minutes to kill, but never was interested in looking at the results.

Reliable consumer surveys of niche product like this are possible, but difficult or expensive to do. Microsoft, with its access to user data, could do one reasonably efficiently, at least for the MSFS community. They would get more responses from some types of users than others, but that could be handled with quotas or weighting. They would also be able to extend some type of incentive, such as a few bucks marketplace credit, that would appeal to most respondents.

Anyone else would have to use one of the general consumer survey panels that exist, and hope to find enough flight sim users for a survey.

August

[tiger1962]

Microsoft, with its access to user data, could do one reasonably efficiently, at least for the MSFS community.

I expect the telemetry built-in to Windows, XBox and MSFS itself is already doing that.

[J.Case]

I expect the telemetry built-in to Windows, XBox and MSFS itself is already doing that.

+1

[Javis]

Couldn't we do one ourselves, sort of, just for fun ?... ( either regarding SOH (older sims included) or just our precious MSFS department )

Who's flying MSFS and who still flies the older sims and with what and why (or is that inappropriate ?....), what's keeping you from flying MSFS, best 2023 payware aircraft models and scenery for MSFS2020 or for all sims (list of 5 f.i.) ,like wise freeware, what system do you use, what MSFS2024 expectations, are you planning to buy MSFS2024, what still missing in MSFS2020, what kind of peripherals, what are the best peripherals, do you fly VR and compared to 2D how much, what VR brand do you use, what other sims do you use, etc. and so on und so weiter. Just to name a few, feel free to pile up on it.

Could be fun and/or maybe interesting ?

How do we setup such a more or less specific survey for just SOH users (and maybe visitors ). Isn't there some sort of a standard survey document that is free to use and can be adapted to our needs/ liking ?

Off course we can also forgettabout it

[Priller]

Couldn't we do one ourselves, sort of, just for fun ?... ( either regarding SOH (older sims included) or just our precious MSFS department )

Who's flying MSFS and who still flies the older sims and with what and why (or is that inappropriate ?....), what's keeping you from flying MSFS, best 2023 payware aircraft models and scenery for MSFS2020 or for all sims (list of 5 f.i.) ,like wise freeware, what system do you use, what MSFS2024 expectations, are you planning to buy MSFS2024, what still missing in MSFS2020, what kind of peripherals, what are the best peripherals, do you fly VR and compared to 2D how much, what VR brand do you use, what other sims do you use, etc. and so on und so weiter. Just to name a few, feel free to pile up on it.

Could be fun and/or maybe interesting ?

How do we setup such a more or less specific survey for just SOH users (and maybe visitors ). Isn't there some sort of a standard survey document that is free to use and can be adapted to our needs/ liking ?

Off course we can also forgettabout it

I agree! You're staff, make it so!

priller

[FAC257]

With the forums on SOH covering just about every important flight sim currently in use, I think it would be very interesting.

I started flight simming over 30 years ago, with the ones I have on the computer now bringing it up to 70 flight sim titles I've flown in that time span. I've taken the Navigraph survey in the past but after seeing the pole results for few years, I find that the data is far removed from my category or interests as a flight simmer. IMO, one from SOH would hit much closer to home.


Forest

[K5083]

I handle a lot of surveys in my work. There aren't a lot of short cuts to do a full-on custom one (PMDG quality), but for free pilot testing and prototyping (freeware quality), Surveymonkey used to be the go-to. I haven't used it in a while, don't know if it still is. I'd be willing to help out with the design and implementation if there is interest.

August

[jmig]

I'm in! I have lots of fligghtsim experience. Why, I remember hanging out with Eddie Rickenbacker. "Eddie", I said... well maybe I am not THAT old.

I do recall showing one of my wife's colleagues the first MicroSoft first flight sim on the green screen of my suitcase sized "portable." I showed it off by flying this little green cartoon airplane between the cartoonish green lined twin towers in New York. He looked at my wife with this "You married this guy?" look. What could I say, he was a Librarian, like my wife. What do Librarians know about cool flightsims? Especially an academian. He later became and still is one of our best friends.

[Javis]

I agree! You're staff, make it so!

Hehe... steady on, mate, easier said then done me thinks. And btw, only the P3D forum is my jurisdiction and you know about its status...

But sure i'd be willing to atleast look into it provided the effort will meet the interest.

@ August: thanks for your offer to help. Looks like Surveymonkey is still on the road. Taking a look at it. But like you say, all depends on the interest. Atm seems not too overwhelming...