New Hi-Poly Spitfire in the works - Page 3
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Thread: New Hi-Poly Spitfire in the works

  1. #51
    Remember to link the spring tabs to their respective ailerons in the model hierarchy, just like you link each aileron to its respective wing.
    Tom
    __________________________________________________ ___________________________________________
    Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding. Proverbs 4:7



  2. #52
    Shaping up very nicely!
    John
    (DR/ MAW/ ETO/ PTO Textures)

    Keep it coming!

  3. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by hairyspin View Post
    Remember to link the spring tabs to their respective ailerons in the model hierarchy, just like you link each aileron to its respective wing.
    Thanks for the heads up! It's the kind of thing I'd forget in the heat of the moment

    Quote Originally Posted by Bravo/4 View Post
    Shaping up very nicely!
    Thank you! There are no modelling challenges I feel I can't overcome, but mapping will likely prove...fun.

  4. #54
    Ailerons are more or less done! The blisters for the linkages need some more work but otherwise I'm fairly happy!






    https://youtu.be/gqkmTtihI_s

  5. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by lythronax View Post
    ... There are no modelling challenges I feel I can't overcome, but mapping will likely prove...fun.
    It's fun all right, and games...

    Something we all learn, often the hard way, is to map before doing keyframe animations, because a Reset XForm should be applied to all objects before mapping to avoid scaling problems. That will also reset the pivot for an object to the Gmax world alignment and it will need realigned to suit animations where they are intended. Same goes for model hierarchy – link each object in the hierarchy after mapping, not before.
    Tom
    __________________________________________________ ___________________________________________
    Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding. Proverbs 4:7



  6. #56
    Took a visit to my local Spit (F Mk 21 serial no. LA198) to get some photos of parts I don't have plans for; I think I recreated the aileron bulges/linkages as best I could! Plus, due to tolerances, there's a bit of leeway anyways.


    I'm also happy with how my rudder and and fin-to-fuselage fairing came out, though I may in fact want to extrude it out yet further as it sits even less flush than how I've modelled it!


    I'll be getting back to work on the model soon, I've been tinkering with the flight model the past week or so - I think its ready. I anyone would like the WIP aircraft file to try it out in-sim shoot me a DM


  7. #57
    The FM I'm sure will be interesting. The initial reports for handling were not favorable for those early Mk.21s!

  8. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by gecko View Post
    The FM I'm sure will be interesting. The initial reports for handling were not favorable for those early Mk.21s!
    Indeed! I've followed the very first evaluation and incorporated some of the quirks and complaints. The "post war" variant I plan to include will be the modified one.

    Here is the standard WWII variant (as opposed to the "early" variant with extended tips) in-sim now with standard F 21 tips and corresponding FM changes!





    Here is the WIP aircraft file, if anyone has any tips/comments on the FM.
    spitfire_21.zip

  9. #59
    Aha! I know that Mk.21 well…
    Tom
    __________________________________________________ ___________________________________________
    Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding. Proverbs 4:7



  10. #60
    Not being terribly familiar with the Mk.21, there seem to be a long wingtip version, and a standard version, and somewhere along the way one or both versions had modifications made to the trim and balance tabs to make handling characteristics acceptable. Apparently only No.91 Squadron was operational with them (in a secondary capacity) during WWII. Which of these versions did they actually take into combat?

  11. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by gecko View Post
    Not being terribly familiar with the Mk.21, there seem to be a long wingtip version, and a standard version, and somewhere along the way one or both versions had modifications made to the trim and balance tabs to make handling characteristics acceptable. Apparently only No.91 Squadron was operational with them (in a secondary capacity) during WWII. Which of these versions did they actually take into combat?
    The later version. As far as I know only DP851 had the high altitude wing, as a lot of combat was at high altitude in 1942. And the 'standard wing' isn't standard, it was extensively redesigned although the span was the same; it was clipped for the later 22s and the 24s, the way it was clipped shows the different structure.
    Andy

  12. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by gecko View Post
    Not being terribly familiar with the Mk.21, there seem to be a long wingtip version, and a standard version, and somewhere along the way one or both versions had modifications made to the trim and balance tabs to make handling characteristics acceptable. Apparently only No.91 Squadron was operational with them (in a secondary capacity) during WWII. Which of these versions did they actually take into combat?
    The first F 21s were constructed with the extended wingtips, with the service trials being performed with them fitted, but by the time No. 91 received their first examples in January 1945 they had the standard tips. They were fully equipped and operational with F 21s throughout April and May of 1945; I'm not sure what modifications their aircraft had as they appear to have had the earlier unmodified elevator with the full balance horn, going off photos, plus the fact the modifications were not officially enacted until March. Despite the handling problems reported by the evaluators the pilots of No. 91 were delighted with the new marque, which leads me to think the aircraft used in the trials (LA187) was a "dud" with particularly bad handling.

    I'm including both extended and standard wing variants for completions sake!

  13. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by lythronax View Post
    ... I'm not sure what modifications their aircraft had as they appear to have had the earlier unmodified elevator with the full balance horn, going off photos, plus the fact the modifications were not officially enacted until March. Despite the handling problems reported by the evaluators the pilots of No. 91 were delighted with the new marque, which leads me to think the aircraft used in the trials (LA187) was a "dud" with particularly bad handling.
    Alfred Price (The Spitfire Story) explains the F.21 problems as being of over-control:–

    ...and in each case modifications to the controls provided the cure. The rudder over-control was cured by removing the balance action of the rudder trim tab. The elevator over-control was cured by reducing the gearing to the elevator trim tab by half and by fitting metal-covered elevators with rounded-off horn balances of slightly reduced area.
    LA187 was the first production F.21 and its problems were common among the early aircraft, including LA201 which the AFDU tested in November & December 1944: their report was scathing and recommended withdrawing the F.21 from operations. The modifications were incorporated on LA215, the aircraft tested by the AFDU in March 1945: they recommended these modifications be incorporated immediately in all production models, including the squadron equipped with F.21s and the aircraft to be cleared for operational flying.

    The best answer to the F.21's handling was the enlarged tail fitted to the F.22 and F.24: it was enormous compared to the Mk.I's. IIRC it was fully twice the width and height of the original, but the rudder hinge line was the same distance from the firewall (frame 5?) as all Spitfires.
    Tom
    __________________________________________________ ___________________________________________
    Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding. Proverbs 4:7



  14. #64

    Fascinating and Excellent!

    Lots of encouragement

  15. #65

  16. #66
    Imported! (plus rudimentary early-style elevator)




  17. #67

  18. #68
    I have my suspicions, but for some reason I've been having trouble viewing images in the forum.

  19. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by gecko View Post
    I have my suspicions, but for some reason I've been having trouble viewing images in the forum.
    Here are the direct links to the albums!

  20. #70
    A peek at the geometry so far...

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    (the spinner will not be that high poly in the final model, that was just a test of the Turbosmooth modifier)

  21. #71
    This little bump to clear the (single!) magneto is a difficult one to find sources on; I've had to use an old scale drawing from the 80s which, while decent for the era, have questionable accuracy.

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  22. #72
    Looking good! (all the pics are showing now)

    Hang on, what? A single magneto? It must be a dual magneto (two magnetos sharing a drive and case) since there are still two ignition switches. I can't imagine they would only give it a single source of ignition. I always that the bulge was where they put the Coffman starter.

  23. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by gecko View Post
    Looking good! (all the pics are showing now)

    Hang on, what? A single magneto? It must be a dual magneto (two magnetos sharing a drive and case) since there are still two ignition switches. I can't imagine they would only give it a single source of ignition. I always that the bulge was where they put the Coffman starter.
    IIRC the starter is in the same place as in later dual-stage Griffon Spits (lower starboard cowling). I had read that the reason there is no bulge on later Griffon Spits is that the two smaller magnetos could be cleared with a continuous upper surface no problem; though bear in mind I could be completely wrong!

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    EDIT: You're right! It used one large dual mag.

  24. #74
    Quite happy with how all the details are looking in-sim!

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  25. #75
    Member sixstrings5859's Avatar
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    Stunning ! Great to see the wonderful progress ! Thanks

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